Conversation on the words: “My Father works until now...”

The conversation on the words: “My Father is doing until now...” (4 chapters) was delivered on July 17, 399 in Constantinople and is dedicated to the anti-Arian polemic about the equality of the Father and the Son. This conversation was delivered after Easter and was directed against the people’s enthusiasm for spectacles and lists on Good Friday or Holy Saturday. The Jews persecuted Christ not only because He violated the Sabbath, but also because He called God His own Father, making Himself equal to God. St. John proves that the words of John 5:7 were not a Jewish assumption, but the conclusion of Christ. “And if you want to know ... what is the work of the Father and the Son, I can call (it) the providence of what exists. ...Everything visible happened within six days...; industry did not stop about this. So, Christ calls this providence work, saying: “My Father works until now, and I work,” providing, caring, ... keeping in order, not allowing anything to be scattered.” The industry that St. speaks about. John Chrysostom is the Providence of God, common to the Father and the Son. *The title of the work in Latin is In illud: Pater meus usque modo operatur. His is about the fact that one should not go to the lists or to the spectacles. And having grieved them, then at the meeting that took place after that Sunday, he yielded to speak to the bishop who had arrived from Galatia, and after being silent, also at this (meeting), having grieved, he spoke this conversation in the great church with the words: “My Father works hitherto, and I work” (John 5:17) 1. 1. Recently, in a conversation about spectacles and lists, I greatly affected you; Therefore, I rejoice and am glad according to the apostolic expression, which says: “If I grieve you, who will make me glad but the one who grieves me” (2 Cor. 2:2)? Because that’s why I see great fruit growing from this sadness. And medicines that heal wounds also first bite the abscesses, and then free them from pus; so the word that strikes the listener becomes the beginning of correction. Just as in our body the dead part is insensitive either to cutting, or to drugs, or to cauterization - therefore, even if there are countless (medicines), it cannot return to health, having lost the beginning and basis for medical care - and the one that feels iron, fire, drugs can quickly return to health - so in souls: some, being in an insensible state, cannot easily be changed; others, who know how to be ashamed and blush, grieve and be upset during reproaches, provide us with the greatest proof that they will soon be removed from depravity. That is why blessed Paul, knowing this, strongly approved of those who were saddened and rejoiced for them, and rejected those who were otherwise inclined, saying: “They, having reached the point of insensibility, gave themselves over to debauchery so that they commit all uncleanness with gluttony” (Eph. 4:19). How can one who cannot grieve ever be corrected, unless he first learns to do so himself? Since you have succeeded in this, we are very calm about your love, because if one conversation has hurt you so much and led to such anxiety that you are worried, agitated and embarrassed, then it is quite clear that the second and third added will free you from the whole illness. And know that I am not flattering you when I say this: by what you have recently discovered, you have testified to the truth of what we have said. In fact, being so wounded, so distressed, being in such sorrow and anxiety, the next Sunday you staged for us a more brilliant spectacle, a larger gathering and with greater zeal, and you were all delighted, everyone clung to our tongue, like chicks swallows clinging to their nest. Then, when, in honor of our brother who came from Galatia, we, both in accordance with the very church law, which commands us to receive guests in this way, and in accordance with his venerable gray hair, yielded the floor, you walked away noisily, complaining about misfortune, like those who had suffered a long famine, and wanting our speech to cut, condemn, amaze, upset, doing the same thing as a child does, who, despite the blows and scolding, cannot leave his mother behind, but follows with a squeal, holding on to the side of his mother’s clothes and dragging behind her with tears. Therefore, I rejoice, inspired by pleasure, and I say that I am happy, laboring among such lovers, among you, who have so clung to my speech. This is sweeter for me than these rays, this is more pleasant than light, this is life - namely, to be with such prudent listeners, who want not just to applaud, but to correct themselves, who do not run away from censure, but resort to reproach. That is why I myself am more willing to take up the conversation with you, and today I wish to give back the remnants of what was recently said to you, leaving now the censure, so that, again accusing the careless and using the entire conversation to expose them, I do not harm the zealous. Even if we had not said anything, what happened yesterday is already enough to remove even those who are very mad and furious about the circus from this inappropriate passion. The murder that happened yesterday in the circus filled our city with tragedy, attracted crowds of women, filled the square with many cries, when it was in the midst of the people that they carried him in such a pitiful state, dissected by chariots. He, as I learned, the next day intended to light the wedding lamps, the bedchamber was already decorated and everything was prepared for the marriage - and so, by order of the tax chief, 2 running across the lists below, when the drivers unexpectedly jumped up, competing with each other, he ended up in the middle and suffered this violent and pitiful death, having lost his head and limbs. 2. Do you see the fruit of the circus? How, you ask, does this apply to us, sitting above? To you most of all: if you had not all strived to run (there), this would not have happened below. But, in order not to make the word very heavy again and not to irritate the wound, I will try, leaving it to your conscience, to give what remains of what was said to you recently. So, what has been said recently? I said that Christ is called the foundation, as bearing everything, holding and weighing; Now I want to show this from another apostolic saying. Having said this, explaining this saying, he says: “He, being the radiance of glory and the image of His hypostasis, and upholding all things by the word of His power, having accomplished the cleansing of our sins, sat down at the right hand of the throne of the Majesty on high” (Heb. 1:3). What does “holding” mean? Driving like a driver, leading like a helmsman, managing like a house, restraining, holding, weighing. He not only brings everything from the non-existent to the existing, but even knows in advance what is happening, like the Father who gave birth to Him. That is why, explaining this, He said: “My Father is working until now, and I am working” (John 5:17). That is why the Jews tried even harder to kill Him, not only because He violated the Sabbath, but because He also called God His Father, making Himself equal to God. Where are the heretics now, maddened to the detriment of their salvation and separating Him from equality with His Father? Let them listen to the voice of the evangelist - and when I say: the evangelist, I mean Christ, stirring up his soul - let them listen, be ashamed and stop such their madness. Just as the Jews persecuted Him because He called Himself equal (to the Father), so these too are ready to crush themselves because we, instructed by Him, give Him this glory. But, they say, this was not the opinion of Him, nor of the Evangelist, but of the Jews. Even if they were Jews, then this in particular constitutes your greatest guilt and extreme condemnation, that you, wanting to be blind yourself, do not see what the ungrateful Jews immediately understood as a conclusion from these words. They did not add this on their own, but concluding from what Christ told them. And so that you know that this saying is not even of the Jews, but of the evangelist, both opinion and speech - and when I say: evangelist, I mean Christ, stimulating his thought - examine these very words. "My father." Is it not obvious to everyone, even the most unreasonable, that He said: “My Father” in order to declare (Him) His own? And what did He add again: “until now he works, and I work” - is it possible (these are not words) that he draws a conclusion about equality? And he did not say: He does, but I help; He does, and I help, but: He does, and I do. Do you see why what was said was not the conclusion of the Jews, but a conclusion from His words? If some erroneous assumption and opinion of the Jews had been that He makes Himself equal to God, if He Himself did not want to be suspected of this, and the Jews, when He did not want this, would have suspected, thinking about something else besides what He himself wanted to deduce, the Evangelist would not have left this without correction, but would have noted and said it clearly. After all, the custom of doing this is characteristic of them, both of them and of Jesus; from one or two examples I will try to make this clear to you, i.e., that when Christ says something, and He says it differently, and the Jews understand it differently, the Evangelist corrects. To understand this clearly, listen to John himself explain this very thing. When He entered the church of God and, having made a scourge, drove out the money changers, saying: “...Take this from here, and do not make My Father’s house a house of trade” (John 2:16), the scribes and Pharisees came up and said: “...by what sign will You prove to us that You have the authority to do this”? What is He? “...destroy this church, and in three days I will raise it up” - speaking this way about My own body. But they didn’t understand this, so what do they say? “This church took forty-six years to build, and in three days you will raise it up” (John 2:18–20)? - meaning the Jewish church, made of stones, because it was built within forty-six years, after returning from Babylon, when the builders were hampered by foreign intrigues, and, after a long time, this church was finished. So, when Jesus spoke about His own body, announcing His cross and resurrection - and this precisely means: “...destroy this church, and I will raise it up in three days,” - they also assumed about the Jewish church, why did they say: “... this church took forty-six years to build, and in three days You will raise it up”? - you see how the evangelist did not ignore this, but added an amendment, saying: “But He spoke of the church of His body” (John 2:21). And He did not say: destroy this body, but - “church”, to show God who dwells (in it), - destroy the church, much better than the Jewish one. That one (the church) had the law, and this one the Lawgiver; the one is the killing letter, and the other is the life-giving spirit; that one is the rod of Aaron, and this one is the rod of Jesse. 3. In another place again, after He performed a miracle over the loaves, He sailed with them (the disciples), He crossed over to the (other) shore, and said to the disciples: “See, beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and Sadducees” (Matthew 16:6). They, having heard about leaven, assumed about bread; and He spoke not about the loaves, but about the teaching of the Pharisees. Since He said otherwise, and otherwise they assumed, then see how He corrects this, saying: “Do you really not yet understand? and remember not the five loaves, and how many baskets ye took? nor about the seven loaves, and how many baskets did you pick up? How do you not understand that I did not tell you about bread,” but about the teaching of the Pharisees, so that you could pay attention (Matt. 15:16; 16:9–11)? Do you see that just as the evangelist regarding the church, here He himself corrects the assumptions of those who were mistaken? So it is that He makes Himself equal to God: if He did not make Himself equal to God, and the Jews assumed this based on what was said, then the evangelist would correct this assumption and say that the Jews thought that He made Himself equal to God, but He did not do this and did not give a reason. So that you learn from the saying itself that this (equality of God) He especially wanted to root in the minds of people, let us turn to the previous word and find out what accusation He once defended himself against. What once happened that He was accused of? That he did things on the Sabbath: “They began to persecute Him,” it is said, “because He did such things on the Sabbath” (John 5:16). What exactly are “such”? That He healed the paralytic, commanded him to take up his bed and go to his house. That's why they said, asking him: who ordered him to do this on Saturday? And he said: “He who healed me said to me: take up your bed and go to your house (John 5:11). They persecuted Him, angry because He ordered on the Sabbath what seemed to be a crime and the destruction of the law. What does Christ say in defense? “My Father is working until now, and I am working” (John 5:17), although He could have said a lot more if He only wanted to defend himself and not show His equality. The Sabbath was often broken, especially in the city of Jericho. When they approached the walls, they were ordered to go around the walls with pipes for seven days, and so the city was destroyed. And that between these seven days, no matter where we start, the Sabbath must happen, it is obvious to everyone. From this it is clear that the Sabbath was broken. Again (God) commanded man to be circumcised on the eighth day; and here again the violation of the Sabbath is necessary, because it is inevitable that one born on the Sabbath should be circumcised on another Sabbath. And the priests even violated it incomparably more when, again by command, they offered sacrifice on Saturday; where there was a sacrifice, it was necessary to skin it, burn it, lay it on the altar, carry water, chop wood, take out the ashes and do much more - and thus the Sabbath was violated. To this end, creation itself violated the Sabbath: the sun works on Saturday, the moon completes its course, a motley chorus of stars appears, the winds blow, springs pour out, rivers flow, the sea is agitated, seeds and plants grow, give birth - the earth, everything unreasonable and the human race. When a woman gives birth on Saturday, nature never maintains this law, does not expect Saturday to pass, and then the labor pains would be resolved, but it does its work even on Saturday. And the heavenly powers serve on Saturday, fulfilling their ministry continuously. So, why, tell me, having so many reasons to defend, He does not use any of them, and does not say: why do you accuse Me of violating the Sabbath? - and the priests in Jericho violated, and they violate in the church; Why do you accuse Me of breaking the Sabbath? - and the sun breaks, the moon, the stars and all creation in heaven and earth - but, leaving all this, He turned to the Father, saying: “My Father works until now, and I work”? He wanted not only to defend himself, but also to show His equal honesty. Therefore he did not say: I do, because the creation also does, since He did not belong to the creation, but: I do, because the Father also does, since He was of the same being and power. 4. Therefore He is defended, not as belonging to creation, but as His true birth. And so that you know that what has been said is not a guess, the disciples also once violated the Sabbath by plucking and eating ears of corn, and when the Jews accused and said: Do you not see what they are doing on the Sabbath? “He didn’t remember the Father anywhere there, but what does he say?” “Have you not read what David did when he and those with him were hungry? How did he enter the house of God and eat the showbread, which neither he nor those with him were to eat, but only the priests? Or have you not read in the law that on the Sabbath the priests in the church break the Sabbath, but are innocent” (Matthew 12:5)? You see, when He talks about slaves, He cites slaves as an example, David and the priests; and when about Himself, the Father? If He ever uses another defense, for example, when He says: “If a man receives circumcision on the Sabbath, are you angry with Me because I healed the whole man on the Sabbath” (John 7:23)? And again: who is there among you who does not lose his sheep and his ox (Luke 13:15)? - This (this) is not at all surprising, because He talks not at all like God, but sometimes like a man, since He was both God and man. Here, of course, He loudly declares regarding His own dignity, saying: “My Father works until now, and I work.” That is why the evangelist says: the Jews persecuted Him, not only because He violated the Sabbath, but because He also called God His own Father, making Himself equal to God. I would gladly ask the heretic about this: did he call God his own Father, or did he not call him, was this a Jewish assumption, or the conclusion of Christ? - and, even if he was shameless a thousand times, he is convicted of the truth. He said that “My Father works until now, and I work”: did he break the Sabbath, or did he not break it? It is quite obvious that he violated: I do, He says, and He does. So, both the violation of the Sabbath and the fact that He calls God His own Father - neither one nor the other was a Jewish assumption, but the conclusion and conclusion of Christ. Why, calling this the conclusion of Christ, do you call that which is next to it, connected with it and equally communicated by the evangelist, a Jewish assumption? All this is the message of the evangelist explaining what Christ said. Therefore, also - when the Jews accused him - he said that they persecuted Him not only because he violated the Sabbath, but that he also called God His Father, making Himself equal to God. But this is enough to denounce the heretics; and if you want to know about doing, what is what the Father does and what the Son consists of, I can call (it) providence for what exists, content, care. Everything visible happened within six days: “and God rested on the seventh day” (Gen. 2:2); industry did not stop about this. So, Christ calls this providence work, saying: “My Father works until now, and I work,” providing, caring, maintaining - he says - keeping in order, not allowing anything to be scattered. So, having accepted the proof of the right dogmas also from what has been said, let us add a thorough and consistent life with the dogmas, since it is not enough for us to save only the knowledge of the right dogmas, but we also need the best life, so that, by giving glory to God in every possible way, we can achieve the promised benefits. To him be glory and power forever and ever. Amen 3. According to Min (more precisely, according to Montfaucon † 1741), this conversation was delivered on the 2nd Sunday after Easter, when on Easter itself the saint spoke strongly against the passion for spectacles, and when on Good Friday or Saturday, in fact, there was this passion on the part of the people. The accusatory word on Easter had such an effect that on the 1st Sunday after Easter an extremely large number of listeners gathered, who were, however, annoyed, since the saint ceded the conversation to the Galatian bishop Leontius, who had arrived here by that time. But Mattei thinks differently: according to him, the accusatory word was on Holy Saturday, on Easter itself Leontius spoke, and on the 1st Sunday after Easter the saint himself spoke this, 9th conversation. It also doesn’t hurt to note that, contrary to Montfaucon, Matthaei strongly disapproves of the compiler of the titles before the conversations, for his grammar, and, by the way, in the title just given. Ἐπαρχος τελών, whose duties included managing the collection of taxes (φορολογία). In this conversation, the saint uses three terms that are difficult to convey in Russian, so a reservation is necessary regarding them. This is κατασκευή with its verb κατασκευάζω (we have “conclusion”, as given to an opinion and conclusion), ψήφος (“opinion”, as a definite thought, but not expressed in a word) and άπόφασις (“conclusion”, as a thought expressed in a word). For clarity, we use this comparison. While the ship is not equipped, all its accessories are χατασχευή; a ship completely ready to sail - ψήφος; the ship at the moment of its full speed - άπόφασις. John 5:17–18 breaks down like this. Creating is equal to God, since it is only thought - ψήφος or δπόυσια "assumption", and since it is said so - άπόφασις. To this: κατασκευή – 1) the statement of the Lord: My Father, 2) the fact: you have destroyed the Sabbath. At the end of the conversation, the saint asks: why do you call my Father the conclusion of the Lord, but consider being equal in creating with God (on the basis of destroying the Sabbath) to be a Jewish assumption (δπόυοια ψήφος), when the evangelist’s both are connected. Meanwhile, the heretics admitted the first, but could not admit the second, and considered it a Jewish opinion. Note translator You might be interested in: